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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 8:35 am 
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King or Queen Postsalot

Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:54 am
Posts: 1665
With the split, how am I ever going to "Know My West Coast Servers"?

Totally unfair!


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 1:10 pm 
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Moderating Hobbit
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:17 pm
Posts: 1283
Location: Louisville, KY
Stejjie wrote:
Good grief. Sorry to be late to this thread but I just read about this today.

We've all been lived through and survived a lot of dumb decisions by NTN over the years, but this one takes the cake. Just when you think Duh! was the dumbest idea ever, management trumps it.

Is there going to be a west coast and east coast gold medalist? How the hell do you measure up? What is the point?

Like many of you, I've cut back from an every day player to a occasional player, with spurts of mostly solo activity here and there and getting my old team together once in a blue moon for old time's sake. But there's no fun in the game if I can't compete nationally. Oh what the heck, take away the last vestige of fun I have had playing BT. Even with the 30 minute games back, any high rankings I receive -- if any -- will be worthless.

Bo, many thanks to you for fighting the good fight.


Well, on the plus side, since I'm in EST, if I don't hit the top 100, I can at least call all the West Coasters dirty cheaters. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:10 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot
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Dante wrote:
... since I'm in EST...


That surprises me.
Don't you know that stuff's a lot of new age hooey? :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:13 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot
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Location: The Gloriously Site-Rich Valley of the Sun Devil - FUofA
spotes wrote:
Dante wrote:
... since I'm in EST...


That surprises me.
Don't you know that stuff's a lot of new age hooey? :mrgreen:

You need to seek help. :shock: 8-)

_________________
/```\
(o\_!_/o)



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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:36 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot
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Posts: 1558
THE ICEMAN wrote:
You need to seek help. :shock: 8-)


My mommy say I'm a "special lad"...


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 7:32 pm 
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Colt

Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:13 pm
Posts: 45
Location: Wild Bill's - Woodbury, MN
Tee hee.... 2PM Central time buzztime, Feb 9...

[img]
Attachment:
Fsplit.jpg
[/img]


Attachments:
Fsplit.jpg
Fsplit.jpg [ 56.58 KiB | Viewed 1323 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 2:43 am 
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Lotsa Posta

Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 1:03 pm
Posts: 785
Location: Delaware
bacho wrote:
Tee hee.... 2PM Central time buzztime, Feb 9...

[img]
Attachment:
Fsplit.jpg
[/img]

<golf clap> :D


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 11:16 pm 
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Sir or Dame Postsalot

Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:50 pm
Posts: 264
Location: Montgomery County MD
THE ICEMAN wrote:
spotes wrote:
Dante wrote:
... since I'm in EST...


That surprises me.
Don't you know that stuff's a lot of new age hooey? :mrgreen:

You need to seek help. :shock: 8-)
And a bathroom.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:27 am 
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Regular Member
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Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:47 pm
Posts: 65
I recently posted on their FB page....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was polite and did not "tag" you in the post. Then I remembered - I am not a polite person. And, you deserve to see my recent status.

"I don't normally do this... but, if you have stock in NTN, I have some advice for you. The lawyer in me would like you to know that you may have a derivative claim -- they are ruining your company and devaluing your shares. Call a lawyer. The financial person ...in me wants you to know you should dump that stock. It's about to tank (from it's current height of less than a quarter per share). Seriously,NTN - you are doing the wrong thing."

Sure - it's rude to suggest that litigation should be brought against you. But, those of you offended are human beings who work FOR the corporation which exists and is owned BY the shareholders. You are destroying the entity which DOES NOT BELONG TO YOU. I am 100% against corporations being people, but that is the state of the law. And, you are beating up good people. For a system that attracts some of the best and brightest where the hell did you find the idiots who run this joint? I work at a financial services firm. I am tempted to buy a share today JUST to research the possiblity of a claim. I hope some lawyer with a few shares and some time on his/her hands does file something. You are destroying a product that you contracted with other to provide.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is utter horseshit.

That is all.

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RABBIT

I'm not bad -- I'm just drawn that way.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:23 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot

Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:54 am
Posts: 1665
bacho wrote:
Tee hee.... 2PM Central time buzztime, Feb 9...

[img]
Attachment:
Fsplit.jpg
[/img]



Saw FSPLIT out of PB & G the other night...

LILJOL?


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:51 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:59 pm
Posts: 2292
RABBIT wrote:
I recently posted on their FB page....


As if anyone needed any more evidence why we love having RABBIT on our team...

Oh, and also: Don't ever cross RABBIT if you know what's good for you. :)

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Anon
"He may seem like Mr. Rogers but a dark spirit lies beneath."


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:52 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:41 pm
Posts: 2497
tiefly wrote:
Saw FSPLIT out of PB & G the other night...

LILJOL?

Image

_________________
liljol, still residing in a humble lil abode in Buzztime's Backyard, San Diego County, in The Horribly Site-Poor Golden State, California...

<--805 NTN Buzztime sites visited as of 11/13/2018...

F CUBS!!!!! FBOSOX!!!!!

FPDRES!!!!! FCHGRS!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:55 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:41 pm
Posts: 2497
ANON wrote:
RABBIT wrote:
I recently posted on their FB page....

As if anyone needed any more evidence why we love having RABBIT on our team...

Oh, and also: Don't ever cross RABBIT if you know what's good for you. :)

FWIW, as of the time of this post, there were two "Likes", including mine. :)

_________________
liljol, still residing in a humble lil abode in Buzztime's Backyard, San Diego County, in The Horribly Site-Poor Golden State, California...

<--805 NTN Buzztime sites visited as of 11/13/2018...

F CUBS!!!!! FBOSOX!!!!!

FPDRES!!!!! FCHGRS!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:04 pm 
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King or Queen Postsalot

Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 2:25 pm
Posts: 1028
RABBIT wrote:
I recently posted on their FB page....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was polite and did not "tag" you in the post. Then I remembered - I am not a polite person. And, you deserve to see my recent status.

"I don't normally do this... but, if you have stock in NTN, I have some advice for you. The lawyer in me would like you to know that you may have a derivative claim -- they are ruining your company and devaluing your shares. Call a lawyer. The financial person ...in me wants you to know you should dump that stock. It's about to tank (from it's current height of less than a quarter per share). Seriously,NTN - you are doing the wrong thing."

Sure - it's rude to suggest that litigation should be brought against you. But, those of you offended are human beings who work FOR the corporation which exists and is owned BY the shareholders. You are destroying the entity which DOES NOT BELONG TO YOU. I am 100% against corporations being people, but that is the state of the law. And, you are beating up good people. For a system that attracts some of the best and brightest where the hell did you find the idiots who run this joint? I work at a financial services firm. I am tempted to buy a share today JUST to research the possiblity of a claim. I hope some lawyer with a few shares and some time on his/her hands does file something. You are destroying a product that you contracted with other to provide.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is utter horseshit.

That is all.


I also laughed when I saw this, good job! Too bad they don't give a rat's ass about integrity, they have no idea how bad this is..

_________________
Buzztime is a company full of dumbshits.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:22 pm 
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Lord or Lady Postsalot

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:30 pm
Posts: 558
Although I was happy to get a response at all to my addition to the FB page inquiring why they're not testing their theory before breaking the network, I found this particularly annoying:

"NTN Buzztime, Inc. ‎Brooke - this was discussed but because of the complexity of our system this was not a feasible option for us."

Really? Unfeasible--when they did exactly that three years ago? (Not that they listened to the feedback they received from the players who went to the test sites and played BT Trivia, but it's certainly feasible. Here's my reply on their FB page:

"Hmm--I remember in Aug. 2008 you were able to make test locations out of a number of places when BT Trivia was being introduced. My husband and I went to Lucky's to play (now one of many defunct BT locations because it never knew how to grow a player base). And other locations on your current network such as Hooter's receive special games that differ from what the rest of the network is playing. So it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me that you couldn't put the premium game in the 7 p.m. PST slot at x number of test locations and see what happens. This would be considered a prudent business practice before going "all-in" on an untested hypothesis--one that people who do know how player bases are grown consider illogical and doomed to failure."

Brooke/AARDVK


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 3:08 pm 
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Lord or Lady Postsalot

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:30 pm
Posts: 558
This gets sillier and sillier. Here's BT's explanation of why it can't test its hypothesis:

"You are correct, we test everything at a group of test locations before it goes out network-wide, however, because this touches all of our existing products, it just was not feasible. It would have broken stat feeds and such online. There were just too many moving parts."

So the justification for not testing the assumptions underlying a huge change that impacts all of their products is that it's not feasible because the impact is too big? Isn't that a really, really good reason not to implement it, especially in the face of widespread opposition?

However, I do agree with BT on one thing--if they go through with this untested, unproved strategy, there will indeed be even more moving parts--locations moving chargers and boxes out of the door, followed by the former players.

Brooke/AARDVK


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:31 pm 
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Lord of Scaratings
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:57 pm
Posts: 2218
Well, I hope somebody backs up the old code "before they move all the parts" so they can restore it if they choose.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 4:40 pm 
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Regular Member
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Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:47 pm
Posts: 65
AARDVK wrote:
This gets sillier and sillier. Here's BT's explanation of why it can't test its hypothesis:

"You are correct, we test everything at a group of test locations before it goes out network-wide, however, because this touches all of our existing products, it just was not feasible. It would have broken stat feeds and such online. There were just too many moving parts."

So the justification for not testing the assumptions underlying a huge change that impacts all of their products is that it's not feasible because the impact is too big? Isn't that a really, really good reason not to implement it, especially in the face of widespread opposition?

However, I do agree with BT on one thing--if they go through with this untested, unproved strategy, there will indeed be even more moving parts--locations moving chargers and boxes out of the door, followed by the former players.

Brooke/AARDVK


AARDVK -- you hit the nail on the head as they say. They all but admitted to violating the prudent business practices standard... and that can create HUGE liability. I responded similarly to your FB post.

If you own shares - call a lawyer. These people are NUTS!

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RABBIT

I'm not bad -- I'm just drawn that way.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:39 pm 
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Sir or Dame Postsalot

Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 8:57 pm
Posts: 267
I've been a shareholder since the 90's. Bought in at $3.63 back when $3.63 was still known as 3 and five-eighths. I wouldn't mind knowing more from a lawyer about what might be possible. If you need to know there's somebody specific right here who has shares and a history, here I am.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 3:29 pm 
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You, in C.

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 12:13 pm
Posts: 37
This is a tough one. I'm a lawyer/shareholder and I certainly think this is the dumbest move ever. I'm no securities litigator so I can't really opine in any expert way on whether it legally violates the business judgment rule. That said, IIRC the standard is informed, good faith and an honest belief an action is in the company's best interest. That's a tough one to win, albeit perhaps one litigated past a 12(b)(6) or a MSJ at least.

Now, taking my pissed off shareholder hat and putting on my lawyer only hat, I'd say this: where are my fees for a derivative action coming from? This company's market value is maybe as much as a (really) nice house in Rancho Santa Fe or Del Mar. I suppose it might come out of the D&O insurance; one thing we all know is that NTN is still burning cash.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:07 pm 
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Moderating Hobbit
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:17 pm
Posts: 1283
Location: Louisville, KY
There is absolutely no chance in winning a shareholder lawsuit on this issue.


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:19 pm 
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You, in C.

Joined: Tue Jan 12, 2010 12:13 pm
Posts: 37
Dante wrote:
There is absolutely no chance in winning a shareholder lawsuit on this issue.


How better (and more succinctly!) put. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Split Games?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:47 pm 
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Lord or Lady Postsalot

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:30 pm
Posts: 558
Dante wrote:
There is absolutely no chance in winning a shareholder lawsuit on this issue.


I don't know--I can imagine the shareholders' committee having a lot of fun in a Chapter 11 case when it comes to litigating things like D & O claims, payment of bonuses to high-ranking employees, etc.

I keep trying to figure out how players could get standing as a party-in-interest. Could definitely be tried, but would need a judge willing to see beyond direct pecuniary claims (which actually the term allows). What could be pretty easily done though is to set up a committee of location creditors, who would have a great interest in what happens to the infrastructure of the network, then make sure to get a few players who are also location owners on it.

Brooke/AARDVK


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 Post subject: RABBIT's comment thread on Facebook re: split is gone
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:38 pm 
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Lord or Lady Postsalot

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:30 pm
Posts: 558
I was trying to access the comment thread Jess/RABBIT started on the Buzztime FB page (in which BT admitted it never tested its assumption that splitting the network/moving the premium games would increase the player count), and it's gone. So has Jess from FB. Obviously this could be just a temporary FB glitch, or Jess deciding to no longer be an FB user, but given the sensitive nature of the thread (especially in the likely event the split topples NTN/BT), it certainly occurs to me that BT might be retaliating via FB.

One of the few good things about the Forum going down is that at least we know Scaratings and BadBart can't be censored by BT.

I will hold additional comments until the reason for these two disappearances is determined.

Brooke/AARDVK


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 Post subject: BT's on-screen attempt to announce the split
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 2:16 pm 
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Lord or Lady Postsalot

Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2010 5:30 pm
Posts: 558
Last night mixed up with all the screens touting Showdown, Playback, etc. at their current times, we saw one screen pop up three times that I guess constitutes what BT considers adequate notice to players. I didn't write it down, but it was something like "BT will be more fun that ever. New schedule February 28. More convenient times and new games!" Then it gave the website URL for more info.

We watched the couple who come in with their friends every Friday for Spotlight see the screen and not react at all. (We will of course tell them next week if BT doesn't come to its senses.) Does BT really think that everyone who sees that screen will understand that it affects every game they play--not just the times, but who they're playing against? (Note the announcement didn't say: "Wonderful news! We're splitting the network so you don't have as much competition as before!")

In any event, if I were going to make sure people knew about the change, I would have had multiple screens last night during Spotlight saying "Spotlight moving to 7 p.m. your time starting March 2," then put similar screens in each of the premium/specialty games. And I would have started this communications campaign much longer ago than 10 days out.

The only good thing is that because this screen was so very uninformative, it doesn't lock BT into its suicidal course of action. They could back off the decision to split the network, keep the current times for the premiums/specialties, and still have everything described on the screen. They do have a new game in Late Shift. There is a new schedule re: Countdown. Although it's under dispute, some may feel the extension of the lunch hour trivia does represent more convenient times. The shortening of Showdown/loss of Speed probably doesn't affect when someone comes to the location (i.e., I doubt Speed is a destination game), so that info could reasonably be delayed until Feb. 28th.

However, I doubt the info on the screen was artfully composed to keep the door open. More likely, it's just the ineptitude of BT and its lack of caring for its current players. I just don't want to be around when folks show up for their favorite game, maybe after hiring a sitter, or making special arrangements to meet up after work, just to find they've missed it because BT wants to delay as long as possible more backlash.

Brooke/AARDVK


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